Extremely Controversial end of democracy

[Lt_Justin]

there was a time when the goverment was afraid of the people rising against them it was this fear that kept them inline but now it has become the oppisite the people are scared they have too much to "lose" what they don't realize is that unless we do something there won't be anything left to lose and by then it will be to late it is no longer republicans and democrats but has become the battle of the elite and their brainwashed droves of robots and the few remaining independent thinking people

Nancy Polosize thinks we should release fuel from the strategic rseveres but in response to this i state that "strategic" means for emergency or military use ONLY sure it would effect the price of fuel but it would do so in a false way and leave is at the mercy of the countries that still produce oil to allow to refuel many of these countries are potentional enemy's we can not give them a target more tempting then Pearl Harbor was to th Japanese in the begging of the second world war we would have nothing heaver then 50 cal machine guns to use against them and only our too few Nuclear subs and carriers could attack at sea the Air craft carriers really only be able to ram stuff everything else would be a sitting duck and it's pretty much illegal to shoot nukes any more.



They want to take away our guns this is the first step to a communist take over i don't want to sound like a 1950 anti commie buts it is true we need to cling to the most important rights we have or at least once had as Americans the right to own land and to bear arms as the first is undefended without the second the government is not looking out for use at all any more only their own individually over packed wallets it's time they remember just who exactingly fought and died and won the American Revolution the every day civilian

 

[yoyolll]

I really don't think it's got anything to do with bringing down democracy. Even if it was some odd work against America, it wouldn't be against democracy, it would be against America itself.

Democracy is, by far, the most evolved form of government our current society allows us to run. Even though communism is a Utopian idea and should bring us to a perfect society, we, as people, aren't socially evolved enough to accept it. This is why it always turns "evil" (which means it becomes socialist fascist and deprives people of their independent rights).

Socialist fascist is a step backwards in our social evolution, giving us an autocratic ruler (not necessarily but almost always). This is why, as long as people can voice themselves, democracy will always be dominant in the eyes of the civilized world.

 

[ImprobabilityDrive]

Out of curiosity I have to ask, is this diabolic communist take over going to be started by the Evil Atheist Conspiracy? http://evilatheistconspiracy.org
Because if the EAC is planning a communist take over then I must be out of the loop. At our last monthly meeting we only discussed how to best destroy traditional family values, and how to further trick the public into believing in evolution.

Seriously though, if you want us to believe that there is a sinister plot to take over the U.S., could you please list the group or groups behind this malevolent conspiracy, and tell us what actions they have undertaken that support your theory.

 

[Dakare]

Uh, yeah, as far as the last paragraph is concerned, you know, about them taking away our guns? The Supreme Court basically shot that down, as stated in this thread.

And as far as the oil crisis, people (well, mainly corporations) are working on alternate fuel sources and energy sources. So as far as the oil reserve and it being released into the market, it might buy us some time and boost our economy a bit so that we can achieve our "goal" (whatever the heck it is) in Iraq and possibly have a strong ally who will sell us oil at a somewhat decent price. You never know.

 

[animaldude]

http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecr...t_the_light_but_GOP_keep_talking.html?showall

 

[ImprobabilityDrive]

http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecr...t_the_light_but_GOP_keep_talking.html?showall

So, the GOP is throwing a temper tantrum / publicity stunt. The controlling party sets the agenda, when the GOP had a majority they would routinely deny the Democrats the ability to discuss, debate, or vote on subjects that the Democrats wanted to.

I fail to see how this indicates the oncoming fall of the U.S. government to a shadowy conspiracy.

 

[teh hippie]

government should be made up of middle class hard working folks rather than high class aristocrats. the government is supposed to represent america, and i dont think the majority of america is high class aristocrats

 

[animaldude]

So, the GOP is throwing a temper tantrum / publicity stunt. The controlling party sets the agenda, when the GOP had a majority they would routinely deny the Democrats the ability to discuss, debate, or vote on subjects that the Democrats wanted to.

1. There's no need to complain... the media did a pretty good job of covering it up
2. and please cite that.

 

[Lt_Justin]

Dakare if we use our military oil we need to restock if the potential arrgressors want a fight it is a perfect chance and their is many problems with alternitive energy the world is a petrulum economy it can't be brought to change bloodlessly and there are lots of peoplpe like me wo can't see the sense tradeing our truck for the stupid SMA!RT car when i then would need to make 5 trips back and forth to the supermarket to acomplish what one trip would have 6 if i like my spouse


it is the downfall of the freedom to say what one belives in because we have too much too lose I ask you to consider if it was your home they were tearingdown to make condos what you be feeling

 

[Dakare]

First of all, the military has their own oil, not just the oil reserve. Heck, they have a butt-load of fuel that they need to replenish constantly. Something tells me that several thousands of barrels of fuel is not enough for military operations.

Second, for most alternate fuel sources, you could probably convert your truck to run on. A normal gas engine can in fact run on hydrogen. It's a tad dangerous, but it works. Oh, and smart cars run on premium gas, and aren't the only solution to the problem.

 

[Demoncrat7]

I think that what you are trying to say is that government regulation is causing our country to fall into communist hands. That's cute. I could just as easily argue that fascism is overtaking our country, as wire-tapping of civilians and lawless enterprises like Guantanamo bay fly in the face of our civil liberties.

Yet, the entire point of democracy is that it is a form of government. Democracy is not dictated by the laws inside of it, it is the framework in which those laws exist.

Gun control does not contradict democracy, as it is not a contradiction of a democratic form of government. Nor does tapping into strategic oil reserves. (A stance which I, too, disagree with)

Truth is, these are ideological positions that you hold. And, although you hold them passionately, and connect them with your democratic schema and patriotic feelings, the existence of laws and regulations in no way indicate an end to democracy.

In simple terms, your argument is purely emotional and makes no sense. It also has no thesis, I just sort of made one up so that I could rebut it...and I have no idea what the thing about smart cars and caring for your spouse means........

 

[Lt_Justin]

unfortunatle you seem to of missed the fact that while laws are nessacry having restrictions on every thing is the beginning of the slide from a republic to communism i ask that every one think of how the laws are trying to make everything even and fair for everyone with no winners or losers but in the real world some one wins and someone MUST LOSE or else not would end and all conflicts would go on till their is no one left alive

I am a horse owner and i will now explain some examples of government stupidity
1. you can not allow your horse to drink from a natural water source (stream or pond)
2. A 2.5% surcharge will be payed to the state for every new aquriculture building to go to LOW INCOME HOUSEING
3. you can only have X% of your land covered by impervious ti water matrial and now apperantly Gravel, sand, and stone dust the 3must common footings on a farm (not counting grass) are considered impervious and even removing the driveway won't help you since the foot print is still there yet gravel absorbs more water then grass since it traps it and allows it to get aborsed by the ground where as it runs off grass if it rains to hard or too fast
4. they are trying to suffocate us horse owners soon we will have to go to town and get our daily food quota just like communist Russia

 

[yoyolll]

unfortunatle you seem to of missed the fact that while laws are nessacry having restrictions on every thing is the beginning of the slide from a republic to communism i ask that every one think of how the laws are trying to make everything even and fair for everyone with no winners or losers but in the real world some one wins and someone MUST LOSE or else not would end and all conflicts would go on till their is no one left alive

I am a horse owner and i will now explain some examples of government stupidity
1. you can not allow your horse to drink from a natural water source (stream or pond)
2. A 2.5% surcharge will be payed to the state for every new aquriculture building to go to LOW INCOME HOUSEING
3. you can only have X% of your land covered by impervious ti water matrial and now apperantly Gravel, sand, and stone dust the 3must common footings on a farm (not counting grass) are considered impervious and even removing the driveway won't help you since the foot print is still there yet gravel absorbs more water then grass since it traps it and allows it to get aborsed by the ground where as it runs off grass if it rains to hard or too fast
4. they are trying to suffocate us horse owners soon we will have to go to town and get our daily food quota just like communist Russia

Also consider that if we don't have laws on anything we will be living in chaotic anarchy.

The middle east conflict doesn't seem like it's going to end until there is no one left alive either.

While these laws do suffocate us they are in no way communistic.

If you want something to compare to, a recent "extra tax" on cameras was passed in Turkey. This and many things like it are happening because the government is disliked and losing much money.

The USA is 16 trillion dollars in debt (last I checked) and I would assume they need some money too. It has nothing to do with communism.

 

[Demoncrat7]

Huh. So basically you're saying that it would make sense to allow children who were born into poverty to live on the streets so you can build your horse a nice, cozy place to live. Excuse the fact that I have absolutely no sympathy for any of your horse stats.

Maybe you'll understand this reality when you're outside of your parents' protective house/health insurance/horse bubble, but making a living in America (or anywhere) is really, really, really tough. It's much easier with a college education, and a college education is much easier to get if a person is born into a family that values education and can afford to send a kid (or two, or five) to college. Government regulation is designed to level the playing field so that, whether born to rich or poor parents, all people have an equal chance to live out the American dream. What could be more democratic than that?

 

[Lt_Justin]

NUMBER 1, 7 I am not made of money in fact the newest car we own in qa 2000 PT cruirser that was really cheap for what it was second I don't realy care about the impoverished who want free hand outs if they can earn it then let them but don't give a mouse a cookie or he want a cup of milk and so on and so forth I personaly drive a 82+83+84= 1 chevy truck with discount paint on the darn thing we can bearly stay afloat here so how dare you accuse me of living it up while people starve to death

 

[yoyolll]

NUMBER 1, 7 I am not made of money in fact the newest car we own in qa 2000 PT cruirser that was really cheap for what it was second I don't realy care about the impoverished who want free hand outs if they can earn it then let them but don't give a mouse a cookie or he want a cup of milk and so on and so forth I personaly drive a 82+83+84= 1 chevy truck with discount paint on the darn thing we can bearly stay afloat here so how dare you accuse me of living it up while people starve to death

You ever think maybe it's the fact that you even have a car?

While you're complaining about not having good paint on your car little poor children are dying on the streets with empty bellies and evil neglectful parents (as pointed out by demoncrat). I'm not saying you don't earn what you have, I'm saying you have to consider others who have no way of earning anything at all and live impoverished lives with little possibility of getting out.

On the other hand, they're stupid poor people, right? Who gives a damn. (I'm trying to show what most middle class citizen's attitudes tell us)

EDIT:
You don't have a number 2.

 

[Lt_Justin]

NO but should what we have fought for and earned be taken from use and REDISTRIBUTED to the poor (ps I hate less fourtnate bull they are poor No PC here folks) anyway what is mine should not be taken from me to then be given to others regardless of if they earned it with the exception of year awards and stuff like that i mean my car s not to be taken and given to a mexican since he is poor

 

[yoyolll]

NO but should what we have fought for and earned be taken from use and REDISTRIBUTED to the poor (ps I hate less fourtnate bull they are poor No PC here folks) anyway what is mine should not be taken from me to then be given to others regardless of if they earned it with the exception of year awards and stuff like that i mean my car s not to be taken and given to a mexican since he is poor

It's really going to anger me if you were speaking of Mexicans like they're less than Americans. We're all people and we're all equal, regardless of race or wealth.

To reply to the rest of that post, nothing is being taken from you. You are simply being asked to give more in exchange for the things you need. I heavily doubt that the money will actually go to poor starving children but the last few posts seem to assume that. By acting like you're better than the "less fortunate" and not trying to help them, you're creating a larger gap between these "classes", as they are so labeled by our democratic capitalistic* society.

Here's where the end of democracy really comes in: the theory is that, as the gap between the classes grew larger and larger, the lower classes would eventually revolt against the higher ones and create a communistic (by which I actually mean socialist fascist) government for equal distribution of wealth, effectively eliminating their inferior status.

What I'm saying is, it's people that think this way ("anyway what is mine should not be taken from me to then be given to others regardless of if they earned it") that will actually put an end to democracy.

*Please note that many democracies are also socialist.

 

[Versac]

Here's where the end of democracy really comes in: the theory is that, as the gap between the classes grew larger and larger, the lower classes would eventually revolt against the higher ones and create a communistic (by which I actually mean socialist fascist) government for equal distribution of wealth, effectively eliminating their inferior status.

Pretty good, except the revolt of the proletariat (poor folks) is what Marx first wrote about, making it true communism. This system would not necessarily have a fascist ruler, and could really rule by any system, as long as it was fundamentally egalitarian (equal rights for all) and classless.

 

[Lt_Justin]

recently the 2.5% tax on agrucutular buildings has been enlarged to include homes all I am saying is to please look at what is happening and tell me where the money is going and belive the schools of camdem do not need any of it